|
Published: March 27, 2008
Torture, “from a moral point of view”
Former seminary rector and anti-euthanasia stalwart assails waterboarding
“Is waterboarding a form of torture that deserves moral condemnation?” asked Fr. Gerald Coleman in a commentary that appeared in the March 24 Catholic Voice, the newspaper of the Oakland diocese. Basing his viewpoint on Church teaching and natural law principles, Coleman, a moral theologian and Sulpician priest, answered, yes.
Coleman, who until 2004 was rector of St. Patrick’s Seminary in Menlo Park, gained a reputation for heterodoxy, primarily for what appeared to be his support for homosexual rights. For instance, in 2001, Coleman voiced his support for civil recognition of “committed… life-long homosexual partnerships.” Yet, in articles written over the past year, Coleman has come out strongly against assisted suicide and has defended Church authority. In a piece published in the 2001 Tidings, the newspaper of the Los Angeles archdiocese, Coleman wrote, “Catholic teaching holds that a Catholic must inform his conscience in accord with truth as revealed in Scripture and authoritative church teaching. Willfully to dissent from a fundamental moral precept is an act of infidelity, objectively immoral, and a scandal to the faithful. A prophetic witness of courageous Catholics is needed now as never before.”
In his Catholic Voice commentary, Coleman gave a “prophetic witness” to the ethics governing torture. Torture, said Coleman, “refers to ‘the deliberate infliction of excruciating physical or mental pain to punish or coerce.’” He then referred to Vatican II’s Gaudium et Spes, which “names ‘physical and mental torture’ an ‘offense against human dignity’ and ‘criminal.’ (no. 27)”
Waterboarding, wrote Coleman, is “controlled drowning” conducted under the supervision of a doctor, psychologist, and interrogator. “The team doctor watches the quantity of water that is ingested and for the psychological signs which show when the drowning effect goes from a painful psychological experience to horrific, suffocating punishment, to the final death spiral,” said Coleman. Since waterboarding could lead to death, its use requires the presence of a medical team.
Though President George W. Bush “has defended coercive interrogations” and “relies on legal advice which tells him that waterboarding is lawful,” it is torture, “from a moral point of view,” said Coleman. “It degrades the prisoner and the torturer,” he continued. “When physicians become a part of this process, they undermine the fundamental tenet of medical ethics, ‘First, do no harm.’ It is unacceptable for physicians to claim ignorance of medical ethics around any abuse of prisoners, let alone abuse that rises to the level of torture.”
Quoting George W. Bush -- “we believe that every human being bears the image of our maker… No one is fit to be a master, and no one deserves to be a slave” – Coleman said, “waterboarding and other means of torture create a master/slave relationship. Waterboarding does not honor the belief and fact that every person is made in God’s image.”
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 6:03 AM By Catholic Lady
Sorry. But I don't buy this one. At all. Whats next? Will it be amoral to twist someone's arm in order to save lives?
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 8:03 AM By Margie
Father Coleman, will you speak up as eloquently for the torture and dismemberment of our infants in the womb? Torture is torture and a person is a person no matter how small. The number being waterboarded is small compared to the infants being physically assaulted and killed in utero by abortion, chemical abortion and pharmaceutical methods that disrespect the image of our Maker.
Surely we should treat all human beings with dignity and respect. I just wonder how strong Fahter Coleman has been on the issue of the most torturous act of our time: abortion.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 9:53 AM By Fr. M.P.
Why would someone who says "Catholic teaching holds that a Catholic must inform his conscience in accord with truth as revealed in Scripture and authoritative church teaching. Willfully to dissent from a fundamental moral precept is an act of infidelity, objectively immoral, and a scandal to the faithful." then ignore his own words and then support homosexual lifestyles? So he only follows Catholic teaching when it helps promote his position. How conveniently duplicitous.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 9:54 AM By Vivian Dudro
I do not find the above piece helpful in clarifying which methods of interrogaion are moral and which are not. All interrogation involves inducing mental anguish, as in fear, and physical discomfort. All punishment involves inflicting some kind of pain (if only in the form of some kind of deprivation) and all threat of punishment involves inducing fear. As soon as one is in the custody of another -- whether held because he is the suspect of a crime or is convicted of a crime, or because he is a prisoner of war -- is at the mercy of the other and is in a so-called "master-slave" relationship (which is Hegelian/Marxist language, by the way). Here is a fact that might help clarify the situation -- U.S. forces are put through waterboarding as part of their training. They also are put through chemical warfare drills, which also induce extreme fear of suffocation and would result in death if not properly monitored. They are put through exercises with live ammo. When is the threat or inducement of fear and pain evil, and when is it not?
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 11:20 AM By John F. Maguire
The question of the liceity of resort to torture does not turn on a measure of the subjective fear induced by torture; such subjectivism blurs the distinction between licit and illicit treatment of human persons. The general consensus of Catholic theologians, rather, is that torture involves
a violation of the integrity of the human person, specifically, the right of the human person to inviolability in body and soul. To be sure, there are aspects of the torture question that have yet to be resolved (where, for example, information is crucial in time-bomb scenaries), but this fact does not gainsay the objectivity of the Catholic norm, keyed as it is to the integrity of the human person: quaecumque humanae personae integritatem violant ut tormenta corpori mentive inflicta.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 12:08 PM By JimAroo
Several Good Points, Vivian! So are we torturing our own troops? By the way the number waterboarded = 3 and each got the treatment for about 30 seconds. A long time ago, I was locked in a room with 25 other Marine recruits. They pumped the room full of tear gas (no masks) and we couldn't get out until we sang the Marine Corps Hymn. Torture? I don't think so but i will tell you I never ever forgot my gas mask after that!
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 12:36 PM By Vincent DiCarlo
The one thing I have never seen in the public debate on interrogation techniques is factual information concerning how effective or ineffective different methods are. While there are some methods that might be immoral in any circumstances, and others that are always morally permissible, there is probably a range of methods that involve some kind of judgment of proportionality -- they would be permissible if there was a good chance that their employment would avert a great evil. We use a similar analysis in the context of morally analysing things like the imprisonment or execution of criminals and waging of war. If I thought that forcible questioning of a terrorist had a good chance of averting harm to innocent people, I might be for it. There must be some factual information about efficacy out there somewhere, but I'm not seeing any of it in the public debate.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 2:41 PM By John L. Sillasen
One method of gaining intelligence information is taking two pow's up a few hundred feet in a helicopter. Then the request for information is made. If they refuse to reveal it, then one is pushed out, in expectation of the other one speaking up.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 5:06 PM By Margie
I hope Mr Sillasen is jesting. Did he ever hear of Divine Mercy? Doubt it.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 7:19 PM By Miguel
I just happen to be walking down the street and crossed at a red signal. Okay I was jaywalking. The police then proceeded to waterboard me and get me to confess. Who the heck do you think they are waterboarding? Terrorists, not the girlscouts. Why don't they point out the people they are interrogating are terrorists who would kill you, your family and your dog. Just because you are a follower of Christ!
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 7:47 PM By John L. Sillasen
Margie, I'm not advocating that method; I'm simply reporting it. A one time neighbor (20 years ago) told me he was a former Columbian Air Force intel officer, and was involved in such "techniques". It was one of the reasons he left that nation and came to this one, a matter of conscience, where he would not be required to take part in such things.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 7:50 PM By bj
Unbelievable! Unbelievable that Catholics would support and promote torture without considering the torture that Our Lord Jesus Christ endured which we just remembered during Holy Week!
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 7:51 PM By gravey
Here's a story floating about: Prior to WW I, there were a number of terrorist attacks against the United States in the Pilippines by Muslim extremists. General Pershing captured 50 of the terrorists, had them tied to posts for execution and, infront of the terrorists, ordered his men to slaughter two pigs. The soldiers soaked their bullets in pigs blood and executed 49 of the captives. They then dug a big hole, dumped the terrorist's bodies and covered them in pig blood, entrails, etc. They let the 50th man go and for approx. 42 years, there were no attacks by Muslim extremists. I don't know if this story true but it does show how the discussion has changed over the past 100 years.
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 8:13 PM By John L. Sillasen
Is it a fact that St Francis of Assisi traveled to Islam lands during a Crusade to appeal to the sultan to release the prisoners ... and have them burn his eyes out with a hot poker? Or is that just a legend on the order of political propaganda?
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 8:49 PM By bstj
If you are" just a follower of Christ" don't you know exactly what Jesus would say you should do about terrorists who would kill you and your family and your dog....something about frogiveness seventy times seven!
|
Posted Thursday, March 27, 2008 11:11 PM By John L. Sillasen
bstj, there are multitudes of "what would Jesus say" ideas blowing in the wind. The hard part is listening to what He actually says. I'm sure you can provide an example from your own life. +++ bj, why would water boarding be torture, since the effects are only temporary? After all, feeling as though one cannot breathe is nothing unusual for those living in southern California.
|
Posted Friday, March 28, 2008 4:41 AM By The Catholic Caveman
Waterboarding is FAR from torture. Memebers of our own Armed Forces endure such as part of Survival School. We don't "torture" our own people.... but we do engage in some rather harsh training.
For more, please see http://catholic-caveman.blogspot.com/2007/11/waterboarding-aquatic-fun-or-just.html
|
Posted Friday, March 28, 2008 11:37 AM By John L. Sillasen
One thing, Caveman, is waterboarding practice worse than singing the Marine Corps Hymn while filing out of a room full of tear gas (on two occasions, yet)?
|
Posted Friday, March 28, 2008 3:09 PM By Miguel
Unbelievable, am I to understand that we should not defend ourselves from islamic extremism. I'm sorry but Christ died for my sins and our body is a temple from God and so is my family. So if you think we should let these pagan's destroy us and forgive them, you are insane. I will defend myself and my family to my last breath.
|
Posted Friday, March 28, 2008 6:18 PM By Gregorian
I don't know how any intelligent man could reconcile the waterboarding with Gaudiam et Spes passage above. If we're going to be the world's international police force, we need to be a model of restraint in these areas. We need to stop trying to invent ways to tread the ragged line between torture and interrogation. We need to be so far from that line that these questions never arise.
|
Posted Friday, March 28, 2008 8:30 PM By John L. Sillasen
How about plying the terrorist prisoners with their favorite foods, lots of women or men, and luxury accomodations ... maybe they'd then reveal their secrets, and we'd all have peace.
|
Posted Friday, March 28, 2008 11:46 PM By John L. Sillasen
There's two things about war: One is winning, and the other is losing. There simultaneously are two wars going on at the same time: One is worldly and the other is spiritual. The Church fights the spiritual war; yet, members of the Church also fight worldly wars. There is a reason for rules being in wars ... the Church. So far, in this present middle east war, there has been no command by the Pope in the name of God forbidding Catholics to engage this war on pain of sin. The decision sits with the Pope, who we hope hears God's word accurately. That would go for any category of participation, whether it be shooting, filing, nuking, interrogating, or cooking. Short of that, it what else do we have but our faith and our efforts to carry out the Will of God. In other words, if there is no precise word from the Pope, then we use our best judgments. "The Lord gives and the Lord takes, blessed be the Name of the Lord": The Church has long provided priest chaplains for the military. If the Pope were to declare this war unjust, would that mean he would pull out the Catholic chaplains? Would it mean that all Catholics would stand down from their military orders to engage the enemy? If the Pope won't or can't even kick the homosexuals out of the clergy, then why would one expect him to excommunicate Catholic military people who were to continu, if he were to define this war as unjust? What kind of scenario would we see if the Italian army allowed the Vatican to be attacked by Islamic forces? Why are there Swiss guards in the Vatican? Why do they carry automatic firearms? What if waterboarding has prevented large scale terrorist maelstroms? What if waterboarding could prevent abortion ... eg, waterboard the abortion doctors?
|
Posted Tuesday, April 01, 2008 2:39 PM By Betty
Here's another story. Some years after World War II I met an Army veteran who told me and my husband a bout the day that he and four other soldiers were walking behind enemy lines. As they tried to find their way back to their own Army tents, they encountered an enemy soldier and promptly tied him to a tree. Then they held a discussion. What to do with him? If he got loose, he would surely tell his superior officers about them and lead them to where they were walking. Could they take that chance and leave him tied to the tree? They decided that they should kill him. They drew lots and our friend was the one chosen to shoot him. Years later he was still haunted by the memory. It may sound weird but you are not only hurting the person who is being waterboarded, you are also hurting the person whose job is to inflict pain. At least that's what it said in the book called "The Hiding Place".
|
Posted Tuesday, April 01, 2008 9:42 PM By John L. Sillasen
I don't recall anyone dying from waterboarding.
|
© California Catholic Daily 2008. All Rights Reserved.
|